As difficult as it is to go through these valley's in life, it is during these times that we really grow in our relationship with the Lord and in spiritual maturity. We tend to float through life feeling like we can handle everything on our own and don't need His help. Going through these situations takes away our pride and shows us our true dependence on Him. Also, without going through these things ourselves, it is hard to have true empathy and understanding for others which in turn gives us a desire to reach out to them as the body of Christ.

I have seen this lived out among friends who have been through terrible trials. A few died of cancer, but maintained an unbelievable attitude and countenance throughout the process and were a powerful witness to the end. Others I know have lost young children. Their close walk with the Lord and the support of His body got them through the grief, and they are closer than ever to Him today.

Personally, I think the fact that all this bad stuff happens can ONLY be explained by randomness and a lack of any divine presence.

Sure you can twist your already twisted logic to "fit" these kind of twisted explanations, but the 99.9999% probable explanation is what I stated in the first paragrah.

I agree with the point that most people's "picture of God" is too small. The word awesome has been so overused in our culture that it is rendered meaningless, but that is the proper description of God.

"For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us." Romans 8:18

God is able to bring glory to Himself for seeing us through the bad things that happen. We can choose to feel His presence with us in the midst of troubles or we can curse Him and reject Him and blame Him for the troubles. I, for one, do not want to go through troubles without His presence to comfort, guide and strengthen me. Keeping my focus on Him takes the edge off of the problems of life. He is good and He is great and He alone is God! Praise Him! His love endures forever.

JCO, do you believe there is life on other planets?

When we go through difficult trials we will learn to depend upon our Lord for everything or we will reject Him and curse Him. The grace of God and the liberty to rejoice when we are suffering are two wonderful truths that sustain us as we travel towards our home. I hope to see all of ;you when I get "home".

JCO, I believe from reading your posts that you are an atheist, and that is your rightful choice.
Do you think that in this seemingly limitless universe that we are the only life? Is it possible that other beings or some type of formed energy exists other than us? People can't see radio waves, but they can hear the transmissions that "fly" through the air and are decoded through wires and speakers into sound that replicates the live voice. Others believe in satellite television because we can see pictures that are beemed from earth to space and back to earth again. From where did these radio waves come? Can you see them or touch them? Were they created in the supposed big bang? Sure, man has gained some understanding and use of these radio waves, just like we've gained some understanding and use of other things around us (water, plants, trees, etc.). You say "how can there be some divine power?" You say "twisted logic". Others say "how can there NOT be some divine power, some divine force, something greater than ourselves?" Even if you believe in the big bang; from where did the chemicals come that collided? From where did the fire come that initiated the bang? Were the radio and light waves already there? If we evolved from apes, why are there still apes? What energy waves, beings, organisms, etc exist that we know nothing about?

JCO,
Sadly I have to agree with you. It is sad that countries almost completely devoid of faith have are so much "better" than countries that are primarily religious. However, I do not believe the reason for this has anything to do with the Christian god, I think it has to do primarily with the Christian religion and other religions.

If all "Christians" lived their lives as they were supposed to, meaning they kept a close personal relationship with God and were willing to live radically being obedient to him this world would look completely different. However, in the US, Christianity has become less of a relationship with Christ and more of a religion and instead of making disciples, the Church is producing snobby middle-high class religious people who are close minded, self righteous and refuse to believe that being a Christian takes anything more than going to church one Sunday a week.

Other religions as well create close minded individuals who reject not only ideas of others but also reject the people with other ideas.

I am in no way saying that Christians should accept other ideas as true. The Bible clearly states that the only way to salvation is through Jesus Christ. However, I am saying that we as Christians need to be more accepting of other groups and instead of scorning them, we should try to lead them to the correct path.

My point is, JCO, that were all Christians to live their lives in the way that our God calls us to, we would have a lot more giving in this world and many less selfish, middle class American Christians who seem to forget the 24,000 children dying of starvation everyday while they enjoy a new Plasma TV and satellite television.

Finally, some honesty! Good post Kevin. I disagree with some things you say but respect your opinion.

I realize I forgot to admit to also being included in my description of the modern American Christian. I know that all the accusations I made are present in my life and it is something I am working to change. I would also like to say that I do believe there are true Christians who do not fit my description living in america today and what I said was only a generalization.
Maybe that helps you Erik...

I think I am confused... I am new to the site in general and enjoy a good discussion as much as the next person. However, it seems like the discussions are not about the topic but rather defending our individual beliefs. For a site built for learning and support of the Christian beliefs the dialogue is more frustrating than educational and supportive. Why, if you do not agree with Christian beliefs, do you find it necessary to attack on a devotional site that was meant be used for Christians to strengthen themselves? Why not choose a site that supports your thoughts and beliefs to find comfort or controversy?

I have seen on multiple posts how several do not agree but claim to be good people who care about others. If this is the case, then may I ask for you to allow me to learn, grow, and love in my relationship with God in a place that was set up for that reason without feeling as though each reading will only bring on another attack of my beliefs. I get that every day in the world around me.

Please and Thank you ever so much for your consideration.