Please elaborate on the difference between legalistically embracing Calvinism (the legalism, you say, of some Presbyterians) and the Biblical manner in which we should embrace the glorious doctrines of God's Sovereignty and Grace in Salvation, clearly evident in Scripture, and as taught by the Reformer John Calvin.

took me years to overcome legalisms... thankfully eyes opened and such peace came when the eyes opened... Precious!

Stan, good question. When people put Calvanism and legalism in the same sentence it make discussion difficult. I was raised in the Methodist Faith and still call it my home. However, I am probably one of the few members that is not convinced of Wesley's view of "Prevenient Grace". Through many years of reading works on the doctrine of election and reading everything in the Bible on the subject, I believe that the "Reform View" is more faithful to the scripture.

Every Christian must have some view of election. It is inescapable. However, even within denominations there is disagreement. John Piper, a giant in the Baptist faith, is Calvinist in his view. From all I can tell, Bryant Wright is not. This is a debate which will not be settled this side of heaven. The debate is confused by people who think they know what Calvin taught, but are misinformed.

I think what was meant today is that embracing a view "legalistically" is the danger. Using Holy Scripture in a divisive way or emphasizing one teaching at the exclusion of other defining teachings is an abuse of God's word. The overarching message of the Bible should unite us and draw us to God, not divide us. However, there are things that are not negotiable in the name of "tolerance". HOWEVER, Jesus did say that he came to divide and that his teaching would set brother against brother and father against son. It's inescapable.

All this disagreement amongst what scripture actually says, and means, is just more evidence for me that religions are entirely man-made. Thus, even the men who made them cannot agree on what their prophets, gods, or gurus actually said or did.

I'll quote one of my favourite writers here, and state that "The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species."

Even Paul had to deal with false teachers that strayed away from the teachings of Christ. We usually run into trouble when we start looking too much to men for the truth instead of Christ. God bless everyone.

There are also those who say the Bible is not literal but makes some 'valid points', making scripture contentious to some. The Bible IS literal in all ways, I know, and for these people, needs to be opened up more and explained more because they can't see past what they themselves wish to see.

The epistles of Paul are the inspired word of God. His instruction on the faith is a primary source of study on any issue related to Christian belief. The Bible is far and away the most studied and debated book ever written. For Christians, and for Jews re the O.T., it is also the word of God.

Wasn't Calvins major teaching centered around "predestination?"
If so then doesn't John 3:16 disprove this theory? This scripture uses the word "whosoever" to discribe the ones who will be saved.
JCO & Eris, haven't you figured out yet that we are not interested in your thoughts or beliefs? Neither of your comments helped with the devotion, they only showed your disdain for our beliefs. Go find some other site to irritate since you definately do not want to make helpful posts. While in your knowledge of your beliefs, you are not ignorant, you certainly are immature when it comes to respecting others. You said in an earlier post that you want people to respect you and your beliefs, we have tried, but you do not understand that this goes both ways. This devotion has some alleys for believers to learn from others so stay out of the way and let this site be used for what it is intended to do.

In Eric's defense, he hasn't commented on this devotion. We tend to lump the two of them together and respond like their comments and beliefs are the same. I don't think they are. I'm sure we pray for them separately. Just an observation.

Eric, I am very sorry. I thought I read your name.
I apoligize to you.
Thanks FCE

Yes, please everyone: This is a devotional site. I am so tempted right now to get into it with folks about their comments, but not HERE. There are so many other social networking sites where one can go to debate all the same age-old issues about the origin of religion. Please. Regardless of whether you think it's fictional, flawed, or fundamental, find another forum on which to air your grievances about world religions..

What is man made is not belief in Jesus Christ but the man made denominations. The reason we see legalism in each denomination is because they put something in their theology above God. We need to rightly divide the Word by studying to show ourselves approved unto God. The Holy Spirit is the one Who guides us into all truth. The Lord does use pastors to teach and shepherd us, but we always need to hold up the Word of truth over any man. We should not think of ourselves as Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists, etc. but as Christians who attend a certain type of church because we are all members of the Body of Christ.

Jerry, Calvin was one of the great theological thinkers of all time. If you read "The Institutes of Christian Religion", his opus magnum, you will find a richness and depth of biblical commentary that stands among the greatest in Christian thought. The word "predestination" is a loaded word. It puts people on the offensive or defensive almost immediately. As I have said before, every Christian belief system has to address the issue of Election. People usually fall into the camp of Armenianism or Calvanism, but even these labels have subtle subsets of meaning for different readers. This is not something we will settle on our little devotional site, for it has challenged the giants of Christianity for 2000 years.

For myself; I am content to know that God is Sovereign. That means not one molecule in all of creation is running around outside of his contros. Otherwise, he would not be omnipotent and omniscient. I also know that in God there is no injustice. Every human being will receive justice or they will receive mercy. And God said, "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy". I also no that no one who seeks God with an honest, sincere and repentant heart will be among God's elect. But then, only those who were given to him by the father will chose to come. In fact, they will not be able to resist coming if they are given to the son. The more you study all of the promises of Jesus and try and weave them together, the more you realize that God is in control. If we seek him with all our heart soul and strength he stands at the door and waits (but he has already made a place for you, because he knows his sheep and they know him. It's a beautiful and mysterious thing really. Brilliant men have debated the subtleties for 2000 years and will continue to do so until Jesus returns.

I meant to say that no one who seeks God will be turned away. All who truly believe are by definition among the elect. The question is: Is belief possible on one's own strength. Paul says that belief comes by faith, and that only by the grace of God so that none may boast. Rest easy friend. You are among the elect if anyone is.

Thank you Grant, your comments have been helpful and gracious. Sadly, I think that those who speak of Calvinism as being legalistic don't really know what John Calvin taught and what they are refering to is actually a distortion of the truth and is better known as Hyper-Calvinism. The following points are some of the doctrines that Hyper-Calvinists teach, and is not Calvinism: * that God is the source of sin and of evil; * that it is wrong to evangelize; * that God does not command everyone to repent; * that there is no common grace, i.e. God only cares for his elect and has nothing but hatred for the non-elect; * that only Calvinists are Christians. These are just a few examples of the unbiblical teachings of Hyper-Calvinism.

I think that sometimes we put too much emphasis on what men teach instead of studying the Word of God ourselves. John Calvin taught some wonderful truths, but I think there is no man that has all the answers. The only place we can find ALL the answers is in the Bible. And what treasures are there for the studying! May we all be good students of the Word.

Stan, yes hyper-Calvanism is one distortion. However, even the proper understanding of the Calvinist view on election get's distorted. The usual "problem" is that if you say that God chose you from before creation then the Armenian will object that man's free will is destroyed, that it would make God "unfair", that there would be no need for evangelism since it's "all decided anyway", and many more. The proper view of Calvin's teaching, and more importantly what the Scriptures teach, is that God can both be Sovereign in his right to choose AND just AND man does stll make choices and exercise "free will". To understand all of this take a great deal of thought and careful presentation. I would recommend a book or CD titled "Chosen by God", by R.C. Sproul as a very good resource in this regard.

All of that being said, I really don't have any problem joining in worship with those who are persuaded by the Armenian arguments for free will and prevenient grace. I do not believe that what we believe on the issue is a "qualifier or disqualifier" when it comes to God's redemptive plan. Jesus came to save his sheep and all who believe on his name will be saved.

What did the Calvinist say after he fell down the stairs?

-Well I'm glad that's over!